Student Loans a Trillion-Dollar Boondoggle

Although we have come to expect every program created, touched or tweaked by the fine hand of government to eventually bog down in  scandal, waste and bureaucratic inertia, the Obama administration has outdone itself with the student loan program.  Recently it came to light that this trillion-dollar boondoggle is producing more and more borrowers who fail to graduate.  Not only are they deeply in hock when they leave, they also lack the college degree that might enable them to land the jobs needed to pay off their loans. Fully 30% are dropping out these days, compared to less than 25% a decade ago, according to think tank Education Sector. Even worse news for taxpayers is that dropouts are far more likely to default on their loans, falling behind at four times the rate of graduates.

Over the years, the Federal Government has become increasingly immersed in the student loan program, slowly pushing private lenders out of the picture. Loan rates are now set by politicians who in an election year have been tripping over themselves in their eagerness to pander to students and their financially strapped parents. Still worse is that Obama has promised to loosen the terms of repayment to the vanishing point, and to forgive debt so generously as to all but encourage borrowers to skip out on their loans.  There is also an election-year-stimulus factor at work, since few conduits for pushing money into the economy are as efficient as those that funnel cash to the “customers” of colleges and universities.  The schools have responded as we might have expected, adding country-club amenities for students while ignoring dramatic shifts in the job market that have made the humanities degrees they churn out all but worthless. The schools have also worked diligently to weaken for-profit competitors such as University of Phoenix, siccing accreditors on them whenever possible and ratcheting up the snob factor.

A Bust Lies Ahead

Meanwhile, the huge federal subsidies to colleges and universities continue to mount as the “clients” of these institutions sink deeper into debt.  Because this cannot continue indefinitely, it is predictable that a bust lies ahead, presumably tainted by more than just a mere whiff of scandal. The good news is that for-profit colleges that actually teach skills that students can use are about to enjoy a resurgence, even as the heavily politicized humanities departments of leading universities receive their fair share of blame for turning out students ill-equipped to enter the real world.

  • Chris T. June 6, 2012, 2:05 am

    “Many students arrive at a “college” class ill-prepared, with short attention spans and poorly motivated to actively learn. Remedial intervention – arithmetic, math, reading comprehension, language, logic – is often required”

    Just shows that the whole notion of:
    everyone must have a degree is broken.
    Those students shouldn’t be there in the first place.

    The old elite European system, not in money but in intelligence terms, did have it right:
    it weeded out along the way, but not to discard those it weeded out from the higher-ed path, it placed them in something more appropriate:
    vocational training for example.

    But that’s just not PC, because “all men are created equal” has been misinterpreted for so long.

    • Cam Fitzgerald June 6, 2012, 4:16 am

      So true Chris. Well said.

    • Robert June 6, 2012, 6:48 pm

      “But that’s just not PC, because “all men are created equal” has been misinterpreted for so long.”

      Totally agree Chris.

  • Chris T. June 6, 2012, 1:49 am

    Terry S:

    While the R’s are surely not doing what you describe for the right reasons, the outcome is not that bad.
    What needs to stop is all subsidies for higher ed, and certainly low-rate ones.

    No different than in the housing bubble.
    It is easy credit that is the enabler of all the that is wrong with higher ed. quality and cost.

    Sure there will be pain when this distortion ends, always is, but what would all those bloated colleges and universities with their excessive infrastructure and administratrion, AND useless subjects being “taught” do, when no one can pay their asking rate anymore (when subsidies end)?

    Either conform or die.
    Surely not the Ivy’s and some, but no matter what that 200k student segment is not what we are talking about.

    Peter Schiff was one of the first to talk about subsidized higher ed funding being the problem not the solution, and he was right.
    Takes a while to sink in though….

  • Buster June 6, 2012, 1:09 am

    I received the following message from Freedom Magazine just today & felt obliged to pass it on here.

    “The freedom movement lost a champion on Yesterday(June 4) with
    the passing, at age 62, of Tom Cryer, a constitutional attorney
    from Shreveport, Louisiana who defeated the IRS in federal court.

    “Tom was an inspiration and friend. I will miss him and know that
    we will carry him and his many contributions in each of our
    hearts as we continue his work.” – George Shepherd,
    Publisher Republic Magazine

    Here’s more about Tom and his story:

    A few months after graduating with honors from Louisiana State
    University (LSU) Law School in 1973, Cryer served as a special
    adviser and draftsman at the Louisiana Constitutional Convention.
    Two years later he opened a legal practice that extended into
    several fields of civil and criminal law. He also argued several
    cases before the state supreme court. In recognition of his
    distinguished achievements, Cryer was inducted into the LSU Law
    School Hall of Fame in 1987.

    In June, 1994, Tom had a life-changing encounter with a man who
    made a provocative claim: He insisted that the Internal Revenue
    Code did not make him liable to pay income tax. Intrigued but
    skeptical, Cryer devoted his first-class legal mind to the task
    of debunking that claim. Instead, his research documented that
    there is no income tax liability relative to American citizens.

    Cryer, who had a great deal to lose, was presented with a dilemma:
    Should he put his head down and pretend not to know the truth, or
    honor his oath to support and defend the rule of law and the
    Constitution? At some considerable personal cost, Cryer chose the
    patriot’s path.

    It became clear to Cryer that the US government, through a
    deliberate fraud of unprecedented dimensions, is stealing
    trillions of dollars from honest, hard-working Americans, and
    using this stolen wealth to expand its reach far beyond its
    intended role. The perpetrators of that fraud are using the sweat
    and labor of Americans to destroy their country.

    To establish legal standing, Cryer stopped filing and paying
    income tax UNLESS and UNTIL the government could show him it had
    the legal right to demand he do either. He was charged with two
    counts of tax evasion, which charges were later reduced to two
    counts of failure to file.

    On July 9, 2007, Cryer was put on trial in Federal District Court
    in Shreveport. In presenting his defense, he learned first-hand
    how far tyranny has advanced within the US government — even
    into the courtrooms. The judge, acting as an undisguised ally of
    the prosecution, violated the canons of judicial conduct, the
    laws of evidence, and principles of due process by forbidding
    Tom to present any physical evidence or material facts. He also
    attempted to hamper Cryer’s testimony, in which he described the
    evidence he had accumulated demonstrating that he did not have
    any income tax liability — and that the law, as written, does
    not say with the IRS tells them it says.

    Despite the judge’s successful effort to prevent Cryer from
    presenting material evidence to bolster his case, the jury found
    his testimony credible and convincing. Following only a few hours
    of deliberation, the jury returned a unanimous verdict of not
    guilty on both counts.

    Following his victory in federal court, Cryer filed a civil rights
    lawsuit against the U.S. Government. He also founded Truth Attack,
    an educational organization devoted to educating the American
    people about the crimes the IRS has committed against the American
    people since 1913.

    Joe Banister, a former IRS Criminal Investigation Division
    Special Agent who has become one of the agency’s most outspoken
    and effective critics, was also singled out for vindictive
    prosecution by the federal government, and prevailed in court at
    substantial personal cost. At the time of Cryer’s death, he and
    Banister were organizing a campaign involving a group of
    experienced, capable attorneys — “people who had been in the
    arena,” in Banister’s words — who could educate the public about
    the fundamentally fraudulent nature of the tax collection system.

    “Tom and I came to understand that it’s all about your intention,
    or what is called the `willfulness’ component of the law,”
    Banister explains. “Because the law is so complex — it’s
    designed to be all but unintelligible — people have a difficult
    time understanding that they really have no duty or liability
    regarding the income tax. We wanted to help people understand
    that this system isn’t being opposed by `evil, greedy
    lawbreakers,’ as the IRS insists, but by intelligent and
    principled people of good conscience.”

    “Tom would often ask me, `How do we wake people up? Where are the
    other Joe Banisters in the system?’ We really believed that
    through our efforts we could inform the public and perhaps even
    stir the conscience of that small number of people in government
    — whether it’s one percent, or a fraction of a percent — who
    could be led to embrace and defend the truth.”

    While Tom Cryer is no longer among us, that effort will continue.

    The memorial service will take place Thursday, June 7, at
    Centuries Memorial Funeral Home
    http://www.centuriesmemorialfh.com/dm20/en_US/locations/40/4040/directions

    The viewing will take place at 9:00 a.m. with the ceremony
    following at 10:00.

    The family requests that in lieu of flowers, a donation be sent
    to the Shriner’s Children’s Hospital.

    https://secure2.convio.net/shfc/site/Donation2?idb=0&df_id=3381&3381.donation=form1

    Those interested in making personal donations to the family
    should send them to:

    Betty Woodard
    3415 Seminole Dr
    Shreveport, LA 71107

    Videos:
    Tom Cryer The Plan –
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIC8d0hf-Ug

    U.S Income Tax is a fraud(Tom Cryer) –
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4nb62cAM3Q

    “It’s a shame that we must remember the joy and value that others
    add to our lives only after we’ve lost them. I ask that you
    remember Tom and our other fallen brothers and sisters now by
    taking a few minutes to tell someone close or somebody that has
    been an inspiration to you, how much you appreciate them.”
    – George Shepherd

    Let every hero taken from us during our campaign for what is right,
    only strengthen our resolve and unite us.

    Special Thanks goes to our editorial team (Will Grigg & Brian
    Roberts) for helping prepare this message.”

    • Robert June 6, 2012, 6:40 pm

      Gods Speed Tom Cryer…

      The “voluntary” income tax is a topic near and dear to my heart. In its most fundamentally reduced state, the income tax legal question becomes:

      Which form of law has the highest compulsive standing- Administrative (Policy) Law, or Legislative (Judicial) Law?

      The obvious answer is Judicial Law, until you understand that intellectual idiots like Ruth Bader Ginsburg, Elena Kagan, and Sandra Sotamayor have actually ascended to seats on the highest court in this land.

      Unless and until the Supreme Court rules on the question above, the oppressive, collective compulsion to “beat the tax out of you” will still belong to those who willingly side with deliberate Treason (what Steve so correctly calls “the Mobocracy”)

      The Treasonists are striving to conquer the Court.

      Once the Court falls, Every US citizen who ever took an oath to defend the Constitution against all threats foreign AND/OR domestic, will have to either exercise their oath, or live with the understanding that they let their Republic fall.

      The US income tax code is unconstitutional for the exact same reason Obamacare is unconstitutional – a free Person can not be compelled in the affirmative to perform any act against their will.

      There is no Consitutional provision written in support of the peer-pressure like argument: “Everyone has to do it, or else nobody will do it”. This argument is legally fallacious against the common law basis of our Constitution, and it always will be.

      At some point the Treason must (and will) be escalated to outright revolt.

      On that day, will you defend the law or will you defend the people?

  • Terry S June 5, 2012, 9:15 pm

    Mark: You seem a tad defensive. However, I could be over reacting to the slide rule comparison (above). At least you, nay, all Rick’s contributors make sense (are comprehensible); write well; engage in spirited discussion; have a moral compass (moi excluded); and, generally (genuinely)respect their peers.

    ps. I enjoy reading your comments.

    • Mark Uzick June 6, 2012, 4:15 am

      Terry, thanks for the kind remarks and please don’t take my criticism of what you said personally; it’s all just part of the “spirited discussion” that you mentioned.

      As technology advances there may be other, possibly negative things, like lower academic standards, happening too, creating correlations that we may naturally associate with the advancements; but, as you know, correlation is not the same as causation – it’s often just coincidence.

  • Terry S June 5, 2012, 9:00 pm

    HEADLINE:
    Right now we have a record number of Phd recipients on food stamps and other forms of welfare. From 2007 to 2010, the number of PhD recipients receiving entitlements has tripled to 33,655 and the number of master’s degree holders on food stamps and other forms of welfare nearly tripled during that same time period to 293,029, according to an Urban Institute study cited by the Chronicle of Higher Education. This is shocking and I imagine its not what comes to mind when most people think of welfare recipients. This study proves that having multiple degrees doesn’t guarantee financial success, especially when you consider the high cost of college and a move by Republicans Tuesday to block a Democratic bill to preserve low interest rates for millions of college students’ loans. The Democratic bill would keep interest rates for subsidized Stafford loans at 3.4% for an additional year, rater than doubling automatically for new loans starting July 1.

    • Cam Fitzgerald June 6, 2012, 4:15 am

      That is a pretty sobering statistic, Terry. I would like to see the link to that. So you are talking some 320 thousand people with an MA or PHD who are unable to find ANY suitable work and now subsist on food stamps? Maybe my earlier comment about the highly educated sitting idly around coffee shops and coming up with dangerous new political treatises is not so crazy after all.

  • Mark Uzick June 5, 2012, 1:48 pm

    I just learned that the Chinese have released gold import numbers for the month of April:

    They imported a staggering new one month record of 104 tons of gold. They are already the world’s largest gold producer at 380 tons in 2011 which they supplement with these massive imports to satisfy domestic demand.

    • Cam Fitzgerald June 6, 2012, 4:10 am

      They still have a long way to go to catch up to gold holdings in Europe and America. We won’t envy them the task of filling their coffers to meet the basic requirements that might one day be needed to back a currency as potent as theirs has become.

  • Mercurious June 5, 2012, 5:23 am

    “Although we have come to expect every program created, touched or tweaked by the fine hand of government to eventually bog down in scandal, waste and bureaucratic inertia, the Obama administration has outdone itself with the student loan program. ”

    If I may, let me offer here the words of one of the wisest of our generation on just this topic:

    “Everything government touches turns to shit.”
    –Ringo Starr–

  • Chris T. June 5, 2012, 4:23 am

    Oh, about the U. of Phoenix comment:

    while I know not too much about them, there definitely is a for-profit diploma-mill scam out there.
    If it is worse than the not-for-profit or state system, who knows?

    But esp. for ret. vets, many of them get suckered into for-profit mills.
    The people runnign those are prob. the education establishment’s Blackwater/Halliburton….

  • Chris T. June 5, 2012, 4:13 am

    There is probably no better (worse) example of the inflation/credit driven higher ed. moloch than the law schools.

    I am not sure of the actual numbers, but between about 1970 and now, they have prob. about doubled.
    Just about all of them are (of course) second rate, really second and third tier.
    But cranking out plenty of excess, unneeded lawyers every year.

    (BTW: a great example of the Austrian misallocation argument viz. easy money, as so often mentioned by Ron Paul)

    There is a whole movement of current and former law students out there documenting and warning others of this scam industry (for example the virtual cheating going on in many of these schools in order to boost their rankings by fudging their stats:
    they report any alumni who has some job 6 months after graduation as employed, even when they are waiting tables)

    For more reading, see the following blog.
    It is really an interesting read, worth a little time, esp. when looking up the various comments about a law school you may have heard of /be familiar with.
    And not to forget: no matter how crappy, even the lowest will leave someone out 125-175k (or more) after a full time 3-year program!

    http://thirdtierreality.blogspot.com/

    From his intro:
    [sorry about the caps, pasted from there]
    “My goal is to inform potential law school students and applicants of the ugly realities of attending law school. DO NOT ATTEND UNLESS:
    (1) YOU GET INTO A TOP 8 LAW SCHOOL;
    (2) YOU GET A FULL-TUITION SCHOLARSHIP TO ATTEND;
    (3) YOU HAVE EMPLOYMENT AS AN ATTORNEY SECURED THROUGH A RELATIVE OR CLOSE FRIEND; OR
    (4) YOU ARE FULLY AWARE BEFOREHAND THAT YOUR HUGE INVESTMENT IN TIME, ENERGY, AND MONEY DOES NOT, IN ANY WAY, GUARANTEE A JOB AS AN ATTORNEY OR IN THE LEGAL INDUSTRY.”

  • Jacques Redou June 4, 2012, 11:46 pm

    Machines do most of the work.

    Much of the work left to humans has gone to Asia.

    The Future Challenge will be a low cost way to keep people off the street and under control.

    The prison model,
    the college model,
    and the War model,
    cannot handle the challenge due to excessive cost structures.

    • Aldo June 5, 2012, 12:58 am

      What is work? Where does creativity and new knowledge have a place in this model? Or not, because human creativity risks getting “out of control”?

    • Robert June 6, 2012, 6:21 pm

      Work:

      The process of combining at least two (of the 3 primary forms) of capital in the creation of real wealth:

      The 3 valid forms of capital:

      1) Raw, naturally occurring resources (whether elemental or complex molecular)
      2) HUMAN endeavor (or effort)
      3) Energy, whether derived via the oxidation of resources described in number 1 above, or energy derived from the output of other forms of work.

      Therefore, machinery does not create wealth. Machinery is the end-product of the 3 principal forms of capital above coming together to create efficiency. Real work is the process of DEVELOPING and IMPLEMENTING machinery.

      Efficiency is also not wealth. Wealth is the nature of CREATING efficiency via the formulation of process (IE: inventiveness and innovation).

  • mava June 4, 2012, 10:34 pm

    Mark Uzick : “Did you mourn the obsolescence of slide rule skills about 35 years ago too?”

    I never thought I would, but I do, in fact.
    I have noticed that those who learned to do the calculations on the calculator, never understood what they actually are doing. Without any intent to advertise myself, I conclude, with sadness, that I fail to see new students as being even equal to those of my generation.

    There are always some geniuses. I am talking about the majority, however. I am guessing that you can ask any engineer that graduated before 90-ies, and they will likely confirm that they see no depth of knowledge in students these days.

    Things has gone so far that some indications of this are glaringly obvious – 9/11, the country as a whole didn’t even made a peep. If this had happened in 70-es, the country would be laughing at “the official theory”.

    Not your observation?

    • Mark Uzick June 5, 2012, 1:01 pm

      It’s strange that you choose to associate skills with obsolete tools with what you perceive as the lowering of standards among graduates. Why not focus on how state involvement in education is ruining schools?

    • mava June 7, 2012, 4:35 am

      You are right, that is a great damage. I was just making a point that I miss the days when we were actually using our heads more than we were using our fingers. Because, you have asked about missing the sliding ruler (actually, they were not often allowed in my school, since they too, do calculate for you, or rather tabulate, thus, substituting your memory).

  • mava June 4, 2012, 10:23 pm

    PhotoRadarScam,

    Yes, it is about the cost of labor. I think, correctly so.
    We as a consumer society have grown so dumb that we no longer have any standards or requirements for quality. We do not demand quality, worse yet, we are simply sucking it up when we are offered more and more replacement choices which are effectively rent vs. own, and we don’t even get offended at the obvious suggestion that we are to dumb to know the difference.

    In such an environment, why should employers not be satisfied with ever less qualified employees? The government makes it tougher and tougher to chose and retain quality people, as it demands more and more care for the employees that deserve none.

    This oppressing government regulatory superstructure on one side, and the ever dumber customer on another side, produce an inevitable calculation that the only thing worth doing is to target the dumbest and to aim for a short term.

    • Steve June 4, 2012, 11:40 pm

      I am not you MAVA, and you will never speak for me or my Kind.

    • PhotoRadarScam June 5, 2012, 7:53 am

      I don’t think it’s about having standards or requirements for quality. In most cases you can buy higher quality goods at higher prices. I actually believe that in a lot of cases people don’t need or want the higher quality items. Do I need a TV that will last 20 years? No, it will be obsolete in 5-10 years. Do I need a high quality air compressor when I’d be lucky to use it more than once a year? No, a cheap one will do just fine.
      But I do think management has stopped valuing quality employees. I’d rather have 1 rock star employee than two mediocre employees. My company thinks they are saving money with their division in India, but I guarantee it’s break-even at best and a loss when you consider the headaches and negative if or when some Indian competitors get up and running as serious competition after we train them how to do what we do.

    • mava June 7, 2012, 4:31 am

      Steve,

      In no way I have intended to speak for the great Kind that you are an example of. Only speaking for my own kind here. Peace.

  • mava June 4, 2012, 10:14 pm

    Robert: “The question is with the moral dilemma – is it amoral or unethical to default on debt?”

    It is absolutely moral and ethical. No questions about it.

    It would be otherwise if you were talking about someone’s sweet of the brow being borrowed, someone’s money. But this is not the case.

    How can it be that it is moral and ethical for the banker to create a credit from the thin air, without first sweating for years and years and yet consuming less than being produced, and, at the same time immoral and unethical to take this easy credit exactly where it came from, into the thin air?

    • Steve June 4, 2012, 11:39 pm

      MAVA – contract law. One says they will do something and endorses the agreement creating CONTRACT. If one’s word is no good, then nothing that hu’man does can be good. He who will steal a Penny will steal a Million.

    • PhotoRadarScam June 5, 2012, 7:44 am

      Actually, in the case of some debt I don’t think it is unethical. In fact, it’s in the contract. If I don’t pay, XXX happens. A loan default just activates another part of the contract – there is no contract breech. In the case of a mortgage, I don’t pay you come take my house. Nothing unethical or immoral about that. Both parties agreed to those terms.

    • Steve June 5, 2012, 3:53 pm

      Photo, A real estate contract is not as ‘clean’ as spoken in the comment. Many are the people who are left receiving 10-99’s for income from the bank after walking out on a loan. In other words somone is underwater 100k and walks out. When the bank sells the property @ loss the bank issues a 10-99 for the gain received by the ‘walk out’. Here comes the I.R.S. with a Lien. If the ‘walk out’ has other assets a bank will prosecute the matter. If the ‘walk out’ is someone who has nothing, then the bank will not waste resources in a court.

      Photo, all I hear is another excuse for immoral unethical behavior. Sometimes things go wrong and that is why there were real bankruptcy laws in the past, unlike what has been legislated today.

      The morality should be based in the Immutable Law and doing what one says they are going to do, and then taking into account bankruptcy for the events unforeseen and unexpected. Situational ethics based in the understanding of the ordinances of men is the morality of “Gee, its Okay to not do what I said I would do”.

    • mava June 7, 2012, 4:37 am

      Steve,

      Can it be that you are missing the point?
      If I stole something, is it moral to steal that same thing from me?

  • mava June 4, 2012, 10:09 pm

    Love it, Rick. Very nicely done short and to the point outlook.

    IMHO, the student loans are not the problem. Who are the creditors? The taxpayers! So, what is the big deal if none of those loans pay anything back? The money would be wasted anyway on something else. It’s not like we would get a gigantic tax cut if not the student loans. At least someone had fun with the funds the government stole from us.

    And besides, since we have elected Obama, democratically, isn’t it true that we all wanted this to happen? After all, doesn’t the democratically elected government guarantee that the will of the people is strictly followed? So, it looks like we wanted to exted the bad loans, and we knew they would not be paid back, – to suggest otherwise is to say that we are a bunch of morons who doesn’t know a first thing about due diligence, or that our system of democracy is something of a fake… That can not be.

    At the very least, the money that we will lose on students, did not go into killing civilians in other countries, and that is a good thing in itself.

    • Steve June 4, 2012, 11:36 pm

      Wrong country MAVA – Republic. You supporting and spouting democracy in treasonous designs does not mean that I have abandoned the fight for Liberty.

      What needs to happen is for Original Jurisdiction courts to re-open and start prosecuting the rebellion and terror of these kinds of abuses of reality – Reality constructed on the opinions of the Framers – We hold these Truths to be Self Evident ! Evil is as evil speaks and saying democracy in a Republic is as evil as can be spoken. When the administrative hu’man corporations are put to rest, then; will there be Change.

    • Mark Uzick June 5, 2012, 12:48 pm

      IMHO, the student loans are not the problem.

      So the gradual take-over of secondary education by the state, making education unfordable without getting into debt, poor performance and political indoctrination are not related to state guarantees of student loans? or that all these things are not problems?

  • Robert June 4, 2012, 9:40 pm

    Regarding the debacle of onerous student-loan debt overhanging the economy…

    Student loans are simply another form of sub-prime, only instead of the predatory lenders wowing the borrower with “Sure you can afford that house – we’ll just plug your into this 3 year adjustable, no money down, zero qualification ninja loan”; nowadays they are wowing the borrower with “To get the best paying jobs, you need a degree from our school, and we have the credit facilities to put that degree within your reach”.

    If people stopped borrowing to finance exorbitant school costs, Schools would be forced to reduce costs to remain competitive, and as costs fell, enrollments in the highest value schools (those that offered the best education for the lowest cost) would rise…

    Markets rule all – to pretend they don’t is to ignore reality.

    Debt is debt – when the burden becomes too great, default is inevitable.

    The question is with the moral dilemma – is it amoral or unethical to default on debt?

    For me personally, it is more stressful to be indebted.

  • Robert June 4, 2012, 7:22 pm

    Once upon a time, I acquired a “diploma mill” degree from University of Phoenix. It was not QUITE so simple as “pay your tuition and here’s your diploma”. I had to write volumes, and defend my stated positions in peer reviews. I earned the degree. My two “study group” partners got a free ride since my personal standards set the performance benchmark for our group. Many of “their” A’s were actually my A’s being conferred upon them via the fortune of which study group they chose to join…

    So, as with all things, the rationale has to fit the circumstances. I was already working in the field I chose to study, and like PRS above, my employer at the time had a healthy tuition reimbursement program in place.

    Since I also have a degree from a “traditional” brick and mortar University, the compare/contrast between the two programs led me to believe that UOP is really for “validating” existing skills and knowledge (ie: resume fluff). Do NOT enroll in UOP as an entry vehicle into a new field of study, or a new career path.

    What is lost (at least to me) today is that education is on the ownus of the LEARNER. Knowing how to do stuff is a very important component of self worth.

    Education teaches no one how to do anything. Education provides context, and it also opens the doors of professional networking. Problem is, more people, once immersed in this world, realize that networking and hob-knobbing is more “fun” than doing real work.

    In fact, Many of the highest educated people (particularly in the corporate world) are fundamentally useless when measured against any valid measure of real productivity.

    Many moons ago some of my colleagues and I penned the catch phrase, “The less you know, the higher you go…” It is more apt today than ever, and it amazes me how many graduates today want to leave school and immediately go out and start schmoozing instead of doing anything relevant.

    • PhotoRadarScam June 4, 2012, 7:27 pm

      I agree that “education is on the ownus of the LEARNER” but the problem is that what a real degree program is supposed to do is truly validate and certify to the world that you have actually learned. An employer can be extremely confident that the Harvard graduate actually learned and acquired the skills in his degree program, where it is a crapshoot hiring someone with a UOP or similar degree. That is why several employers have policies against hiring applicants with degrees from UOP (who lack other credentials).

    • Mark Uzick June 5, 2012, 1:19 pm

      My two “study group” partners got a free ride since my personal standards set the performance benchmark for our group. Many of “their” A’s were actually my A’s being conferred upon them via the fortune of which study group they chose to join…

      Robert: I’ll bet that if you think about it you’ll conclude that in helping others come up to your standard, while they benefited, you, as their teacher/leader benefited the most; maybe not in your score, which, no doubt, would have been an A with or without them, but in the depth of your understanding and insights into the subject that you studied. Teaching is the most effective way to learn. Am I right?

    • Robert June 6, 2012, 5:58 pm

      “Teaching is the most effective way to learn. Am I right?”

      Yes I agree. However, teaching is also one of the most thoroughly unproductive uses of time in existence (unless you are being compensated for your time and effort- something very few REAL teachers can claim)

  • Ralph June 4, 2012, 6:23 pm

    I’m glad some of the readers here caught the unfounded bias here towards for-profit schools like University of Phoenix. The unemployment, student loan debt, and loan default numbers from schools like this are far and away worse than those at traditional schools. According to the Washington Post, we’re talking about a 25% default rate at for-profit schools compared to a 14% overall default rate. In addition, 400 of the 497 schools with default rates above 30% are for-profit. The reader who commented the business model of these schools is to harvest student loan money is correct. The statement that these schools teach “skills that students can use” is laughable, and completely unfounded.

    I appreciate your commentary, but you would do well to back up statements like these with facts- maybe then you’d catch some of these misconceptions. You’re correct that the education at traditional universities are misaligned with workplace needs is correct, at least to some extent. But for-profit institutions are more of a problem than a solution.

    One issue that rarely gets mentioned in the student loan debate is that employers (at least in my experience) are unwilling to train workers these days. It’s a dispensable workforce, and workers are expected to pay for and get their own training on their own time with the hope that there will be employment at the end. Without leadership from employers as to what training is needed, there is inevitably going to be a mismatch between education and job requirements.

    • PhotoRadarScam June 4, 2012, 7:23 pm

      You hit the nail on the head that employers are unwilling to train. They even have reduced hiring new grads. They complain there are no qualified workers in the US but then go to India where they hire them by the thousands. But where did those workers get there experience? They are just as inexperienced or more. The difference is, they work for a fraction of the cost. It’s not about experienced or talented workers – it’s about the cost of labor.

    • Robert June 4, 2012, 9:42 pm

      Another fantastic point, PRS!

      India – where you can get a Masters of Science degree in Computer Science without ever actually placing your fingers on a keyboard one time during the entire 5 year program….

  • Aldo June 4, 2012, 5:11 pm

    Why the continuous bashing of the “humanities?” Isn’t really individual’s sustained effort that determines the quality of their education and its ultimate relevance? (One of the very top performing salesmen of medical equipment I know personally is a communications major. Quiz: How many successful entrepreneurs can you name that were philosophy majors?) Should we forget history, let gadgets do the math (assuming we don’t pick the wrong app), trash biology as existence has no assignable dollar “value” and skip learning how to read, write and speak well. Never mind the creative arts that support our culture, just switch off the music and learn to bully by listening to trash-talk radio. Shall we focus solely on money – digitized at that – until our humanity is effectively extinguished?
    Higher education (Colleges and Universities) should be producing graduates that can think critically, analyze logically, communicate effectively, solve problems and, most importantly, create new knowledge – regardless of the label on their course of study. Graduates will have to adapt to a continuously changing environment – and who knows if a “job market,” as understood today, will even exist. Students are not sausages, fully cooked ready to serve some corporation that does not want to provide on-the-job training. An industrialized, commodified education model will not serve.
    Yes, the Federal loan programs are another boondoggle, but the for-profit colleges are reaping the bulk of the benefits and have a powerful lobby. Federal aid apparently accounts for most of their revenues. These schools produce a high number of dissatisfied customers with the highest default rates. The perceived value of these degrees is declining rapidly.
    As recently reported: “There are quality programs in the for-profit sector — I’ve personally seen them. But I’ve also met students who were misled and left with worthless credits or degrees and insurmountable debt, and there are thousands of them across the country, people struggling to provide for themselves and their families — low-income people, immigrants, veterans, military spouses. With many for-profit education companies receiving around 90 percent of their income from federal financial aid, and with for-profit colleges accounting for about 13 percent of U.S. college students but nearly half of all loan defaults…” source: http://www.republicreport.org/2012/exclusive-leaked-memo-reveals-house-gop-leaders-directed-for-profit-college-lobby-strategy/
    See also: http://truth-out.org/index.php?option=com_k2&view=item&id=6021:forprofit-kaplan-university-pays-executives-a-quarter-billion-dollars-courtesy-of-students-and-taxpayers
    From first-hand experience returning to the classroom after many years, I can say “higher education” is not happening even in the “job-oriented” technical degree programs. Many students arrive at a “college” class ill-prepared, with short attention spans and poorly motivated to actively learn. Remedial intervention – arithmetic, math, reading comprehension, language, logic – is often required.

  • Dale June 4, 2012, 5:09 pm

    George Ure addresses this subject in some depth on his blog this morning, probably inspired by reading Rick’s commentary last night. You’ll find it in his Coping section, below the Advertisement for Emergency Essentials. The title is “Coping: With the Student Loan Scam”. http://urbansurvival.com/week.htm

    • Cam Fitzgerald June 4, 2012, 5:32 pm

      First time I ever read George Ure. Smart guy. He writes like a Hillbilly but was it ever good. I agree with him on too many points.

      &&&&&

      My friendship with George goes back quite a few years — and yes, he is a smart guy. RA

  • B. Kold June 4, 2012, 4:56 pm

    Rick, I’m generally a fan, but this is one of the worst articles I’ve read on this site. Seriously, you like University of Phoenix? For-profit colleges exist for one reason only – to harvest student loan money. That’s their business model. As accreditors have cracked down upon them in recent years (snobbery? really?) they’ve set their sights on ex-military; one quarter of my last class was on the GI Bill.

    I worked at one of these diploma mills, the Art Institute (owned by EDMC), for 2 years. Admittance is open – as long as your check cashes, you’re in. I taught a very useful skill – web programming – and 25% or so of my students got jobs in the field after graduation. Another 25% were struggling. The other 50% were completely ill-suited to the field and will never get jobs in it – all they will have to show for 4 years of “study” is 150k of debt. IMHO, one would be much better off with a “worthless” degree in the humanities. U. of Phoenix, EDMC, etc. have by far the worst records for job placement AND student loan defaults. (BTW, EDMC is 40% owned by Goldman Sachs – when I found that out, it was the last straw and I quit.)

    I think where we agree is that such parasites couldn’t exist without government help. I suppose the only answer is either a draconian cutback to all student loans (which may not be a bad idea), or else MUCH stronger regulation of so-called universities.

    • Rick Ackerman June 5, 2012, 9:55 am

      Thanks for your insider report, Kold. Perhaps in my zeal to condemn our utterly failing college system, I was too easy on U of Phoenix and their ilk. But at least the for-profit schools, unlike the humanities departments of nearly all U.S. colleges and universities, do not have as their primary goal the political indoctrination of students.

    • Chris T. June 6, 2012, 2:00 am

      here Rick raises a very valid point:

      the indoctrination aspect of higher ed.
      What school now doesn’t start its freshman class off with a “sensitivity awareness”, mandatory of course, training?

      I remember when that was first implemented when I was a junior and applying, in a subversive fashion, to be one of the student teachers:
      they made quite sure to only accept the converted, and any dissenter that may have made it through was strictly bound by the set-up of the program.

      They even kicked an applicant off who had written an “unacceptable” campus paper article 2 years prior

  • Cam Fitzgerald June 4, 2012, 4:40 pm

    So lets take an inventory of the damage…

    We have millions of over-educated people who cannot make it as real scholars and for whom no work is available in the professsional classes. Naturally we also have a lot of very pissed off students who think their dream has been broken by a system gone wrong. They have graduated into an environment of no opportunity and were probably unemployable anyway.

    We live in a society where most would prefer an office job with a keyboard and air conditioning over labour of any sort. Even where labour is preferred we now know that the majority of those jobs in manufacturing and other unskilled trades has left the continent and been firmly established in other low wage environments. They are not coming back.

    More anger and frustration.

    So we have a lot of really well educated people with no hope of finding work in thier chosen field and we have almost nobody with the skills for hard manual work of days gone by. That work incidentally was from a whole different learning and skill set that was more commonly passed from father to son over a lifetime and is no less valid than a University education.

    There is a surfeit of book-learning and a massive shortage of farmers.

    Good thing all those smarty-pants took poly-sci courses so they can while away the days online and come up with new ideas for changing the world while bitching about every policy move the government makes. Bad students make good critics perhaps? Good thing they are so smart and well educated so they can keep busy pissing everyone off since they are pretty much useless at anything else.

    They are all so smart but they can’t even guess how to squeeze oil out of canola seeds or save a tomato through a long winter. Not that they really care anyway. Oh yeah, we are all doomed by the smartness. All we ever really needed was a lot of intellectuals sitting around in cafe’s dreaming up the new version of Mein Kampf while leading an austere life of personal struggles and dissapointments against an empathy-less and overbearing state (yes, that is sarcasm).

    Is it any wonder the powers are trying appease them?

    • Robert June 6, 2012, 5:54 pm

      “Bad students make good critics perhaps? Good thing they are so smart and well educated so they can keep busy pissing everyone off since they are pretty much useless at anything else.”

      Now THAT is one fantastic observation Cam…

      My late father (a machinist by trade who was concurrently one of the 3 wisest men I’ve ever known) once told me “I have to train 5 guys on how to rebuild an engine in the hopes that ONE of them might actually take the knowledge gained and then go out and actually rebuild an engine…” and I see similar dynamics today in my chosen field.

      The ratio of people who simply want to “know” versus the people who actually want to “do” is heavily skewed toward the non-productive….

      Everybody wants to be a Manager, and the Managers all go on the warpath against people who demonstrate that they can manage AND contribute simultaneously.

      This trend has turned down, but the bottom is still a ways away.

  • PhotoRadarScam June 4, 2012, 3:49 pm

    What hasn’t been mentioned is the worthlessness of many of the degrees from online diploma mills like University of Phoenix. The government money flowed freely to them for many years and has been reduced a little in the last few years as regulations clamped down a little bit. UOP and other for-profit mills have been duping low-income people into taking on tens of thousands in student loan debt and taking online courses the most employers view as a joke or inferior.

    I should know… I purchased a degree there myself. Luckily my employer was foolish enough to pay for most of it. Most people aren’t so lucky.

    So I see a lot of discussion about student loan debt, but no discussion about where most of that debt went. Perhaps it wouldn’t be such a big deal if the students used the money to get legit science & engineering degrees, but I suspect most of those dollars are spent at dubious online schools and for relatively worthless underwater basket weaving degrees.

    • Steve June 4, 2012, 11:25 pm

      The whole of the system is a bust with educators only interested in a “raise”. Just happened in Portland. Budget shortfall of 20m but; the teachers struck and got an additional 5 million making the shortfall 25m.

      And guess what – I’ll say it again. A product that is 26th in standing in the World. Throwing money does not fix the obligation of parents to teach their own children.

      &&&&&

      Here in Boulder, the University of Colorado was about to jack tuitions (much) more than the legislatively allowed 9.9% a year when the local paper revealed that a half-dozen $300k-plus salaries for the school’s administrators were about to be raised. Who knew that a “provost” was getting paid $400k?
      RA

      .

  • BDTR June 4, 2012, 3:09 pm

    This dismissal of public education reads more like the ‘privatization’ drone of ideological propaganda rather than a necessary objective criticism of yet another massively corrupted social system. Corruption that originates, as it does overwhelmingly in government, in the force of escalating cost influences of a private corporate sector viewing those public institutions and its students with rapaciously predatory eyes.

    How in Hell are graduates able to repay debt, an average of over $26k for BA’s and $200k for advanced degrees in a declining economy where sub-subsistence wages dominate in a third-world-parity driven economy with grim prospects for at least another decade?

    Public institutions are the complex product of the same divisive political stresses, shifting sand agendas of politically driven social initiatives, legal liabilities and crippled cost analysis of the fantasy economics bringing the entire globe to its debt buckled knees. Consequence to the insatiable, parasitic brand of capitalism that blindly destroys its body host like a fatal infection by some vermin microbe.

    Legitimate private education is fine for those that can afford it, but the fact remains that public education is what the vast majority of our population has as its only recourse for future professional preparation of our youth. A future that’s been narrowed by systemic myopia of vision driven by the unbridled commercialism of consumption, financed by unsustainable debt, leveraged as impossibly as is our willingness to dismiss and ignore that reality.

    The worst of these private ‘educational’ corporations target returning veterans with GI Bill resources like some red meat commodity and exemplify fully the reprehensible moral bankruptcy of corporate mentality in education. The U of Phoenix is one of the worst, however good they are in lessons on criminal fraud.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUv3Zc4mM1Q

    “…to forgive debt so generously as to all but encourage borrowers to skip out on their loans.”

    Does that same sensibility apply to the ‘private’ banks that have sucked trillion$ in public and private money as their go-to too-big-to-fail bad debt resolution strategy, Rick?

    Are you as quick to characterize as deadbeat the banking privateer exec’s that engineered this travesty economy, risked and ruined publicly bailed out private institutions, and that pay-out their tens and hundreds of millions in bonuses for the favor of fleecing the muppets?

    Please note that our government is always at its very worst when corporate influence is at its very best. The husk that is our future is the product of banksters and their cronies, …not students, …not workers and sure as Hell, …not Vets.

    • Rick Ackerman June 5, 2012, 9:42 am

      Can’t recall ever having said a kind word about the banksters…

  • John Jay June 4, 2012, 3:07 pm

    The problem for the United States is that the government has become the entire economy. Almost 20 million college students both full and part time because of student loans, plus all the people employed teaching them, which is millions more. The housing market is completely government supported to enable the old 6% RE commission structure, and the 30 year mortgage bonanza for banks. Health care? Government mandates and endless Medicare etc. fraud.
    Agriculture? More government meddling. 20 million people employed at all levels in government jobs.
    We are now stuck with a system that would be the envy of Hitler, Stalin, Fisk and Gould. I don’t see any trend reversals on the horizon at all, just more MS and PHD.
    More of the Same, Piled Higher and Deeper.

  • Benjamin June 4, 2012, 1:48 pm

    I don’t know if they’re still churning out oodles of “humanities” degrees, but degrees in nursing haven’t seemed to have slowed one iota. I expect that mania will end not in a trillion dollar boondoggle, but a multi-trillion one.

    • Steve June 4, 2012, 11:20 pm

      Ben, It is easier in sheer numbers to get into medical school, than to get into nursing or PT.

  • Terry S June 4, 2012, 4:41 am

    “Students are ill-equipped to enter the real world.” Rick, You have no idea of the true depth of your observation. High school grads who can not write a complete sentence. College grads who have forgotten (never learned) how to do research without Google (as in browsing the stacks at the Library). And we wonder why America has fallen behind.

    • Mark Uzick June 4, 2012, 5:46 am

      Did you mourn the obsolescence of slide rule skills about 35 years ago too?

    • Benjamin June 4, 2012, 1:52 pm

      Terry: Your post contains at least one sentence fragment.

      Mark: Grammar and “old fashioned” research are not obsolete.

      Ben: Shut up and MYOB!

    • Mark Uzick June 4, 2012, 5:00 pm

      Mark: Grammar and “old fashioned” research are not obsolete.

      I get it: the transition from printed text to electronic data is not complete (yet), but I think that the day will soon arrive when academic research of printed volumes will be reclassified, or at least thought of as being in the same category as archeology.

      Did I mention grammar? Then why did you?

    • Steve June 4, 2012, 11:19 pm

      What I will mention is that the Trillions thrown at the educators produces a product rated 26th on a World Scale.

  • Mark Uzick June 4, 2012, 1:29 am

    Brick and mortar schools may be the most vulnerable of all the brick and mortar retailers to internet based competition. Just imagine trying to run your hidden pivot classes from a campus based classroom.